Wow. Never seen a topic so biased. We’re all human eh? Meaning people’s character traits vary. Not all of us are listening to rock music and doing drugs…
Nobody is saying that all teens have shit work ethic and do drugs. Everybody is just pointing out a commonly found trait. I have met many an exception to this trait myself.
People <18 can have poor work ethics also. Maybe its how you’re finding them… :point:
I’m not saying definitively one way or the other (I don’t know where you picked up that vibe at all in this topic). I’m just saying that people generalize teens as having bad work ethic.
That’s because generally it’s true. 
Not all kids are unable to stick to a project for more than a week, but I’d never hire random kids, if I was going to pickup a less-than-18 (Hell, less-than-25) year old he’s going to be someone I already know, proven to have the maturity to be dedicated to the project without getting bored and running off.
Sorry, but almost all kids think a month is “a long time” for a single project, and that’s pretty much a drop in the bucket to how much time is actually required.
Not to mention all the other issues, like the ability to work in a team and not run off doing “whatever”. 
Which is why you offer monetary incentive so people are interested and know it’s serious, and simultaneously you interview/etc. them so you know they’re serious and capable.
This seems to be a another “bash anyone who asks for people to join their project” thread! What a fun and encouraging community there is here.
I wouldn’t call it bashing, so much as educating people with firm words not to try to use people because they’re too lazy to do their own work.
Is that what the OP is doing? No idea. My gut says yes, even if the OP’er is unaware. But this is based off years of seeing internet “teams” come and go (In all walks, not just programming) where the leader just wants to sit on his throne and bark orders and never actually do anything. It’s not just a game dev problem, it’s human nature. Lots of people want to have the title of “leader” and don’t actually want to do anything.
If that isn’t the OP’ers intent, I mean no offense.
yea was thinking the same … but …
considering the vast amount on “such” threads, feedback might read a bit harsh - dont think it’s ment that way. tossing out the same feedback over and over grinds you up - especially when we see how many (not many) of “such” projects succeeded in the long run.
relax, this still can give you an impression on how things go about “starting a team”.
my 2 cents : hold your horses! first, get a few people together and make a few demos and at least one simple game for free. if that works out, you might start thinking about “business”.
building an “engine” for no reason and then looking for a purpose is a waste of time.
o/
Nobody’s asked what kind of game the OP wants to make. If it sounds interesting the exact tech and team structure would be of secondary interest and I would want to hear more. If not I could have been out of this thread after the OP and skipped all the negativity.
Strange. He metioned he is looking for a composer, 3d designer and writer. How you ppl figured out he wont do anything. From the post it seems he will do the coding and he needs other members to do the content and bacground so he can concentrate more on the code. Having a game engine doesnt mean he has a complete game…
Most people gave him real advice and good reasons why this is not a good idea. You could point us on the direction why this IS a good idea instead of just saying the community is bad for saying otherwise.
Being a good community is not just saying pretty things to each other. Is saying things that will help you.
This is a technical forum. The primary goal is not to be fun and encouraging- it’s to be technically accurate. The fun and encouragement come second.
There’s a huge difference between “bashing” and giving somebody constructive criticism and feedback.
We shouldn’t have to ask. Let’s say I posted a job offer that went like this:
“I’ve invented a new management system. I just need a receptionist, a salesperson, and a manufacturer. You will NOT be paid, but you will have to be between the ages of 30 and 35, and you will have to work A LOT.”
How many people would apply to that job? Would you then say “well c’mon guys, nobody even asked him what his business was going to sell”? Would reactions telling me that I was approaching job offers incorrectly be considered “too negative”?
It actually does make a difference, Especially that you did not take the time to talk to me privately and understand what my plan was. Although you did give me some constructive criticism, Most of what you have done was “bash” on this thread. So please stop trying to be “helpful” because you’re not, If you don’t like what you read, You can read something else.
Here’s a list of similar threads that I got from putting the word “team” in the forum’s search box. I’m sure I could find more. Notice how many of them went anywhere.
http://www.java-gaming.org/topics/brutal-fighters-let-s-build-a-team/35510/view.html
http://www.java-gaming.org/topics/creating-game-developer-s-team-for-beginners/35703/view.html
Point being, we’ve seen this type of post before, and they almost never go anywhere. And we know why: it’s exciting and easy to get lost in the daydream of “what’s next?”, especially if you think you’ve just come up with a great idea or a new framework.
But that’s the problem- daydreams are easy; real life is not. Ideas are cheap. Frameworks are cheap. Work is not.
We’ve all done the “well I’m going to make this game, and it’s going to be a huge hit, and I’m going to be a millionaire within a year and everything will be happily ever after” thinking- but asking people to work 6 hours a day on your daydream, for free, isn’t very realistic. Especially if all you provide is “I’ve created this framework, come work for me for free” and no demo, no prior projects, no portfolio, no proof that you bring anything to the table other than demanding free labor.
We’re not trying to be discouraging- if you’re going to succeed, you’re going to have to deal with much harsher criticism than a bunch of nerds on a forum trying to help you understand how it all works. If we can discourage you, then just think about what’s going to happen the first time your team has a conflict, or a missed deadline, or a big flop.
You can continue being offended and defensive, or you can take it for what it is: my attempt at helping you by showing you our perspective. Come up with a demo. Show us your previous work. We shouldn’t have to “talk to you privately” to know what your plan is- you’re asking us to work for you for free, the least you can do is tell us what we’d be working on. Show us why that plan will work. Show us other plans that you’ve come up with that have succeeded.
If the only way you know how to respond to criticism is to become defensive and tell me to “read something else”, I wouldn’t want to work for you, and I’m sure others feel the same way. Good leaders address criticism and use it as a way to improve instead of trying to block it all out.
@Rayvolution
Calling me lazy is just straight up insulting me. How do I come off as lazy ? If you noticed I didn’t ask for a programmer… Only a graphics designer (Just because I want my game assets to look good doesn’t mean I’m lazy), Assets don’t put themselves together you know? I’m gonna be loading them in my engine, I’m going to be working on the game mechanics, I already stated that; A game is a collaborative effort, Not a one man job.
But I don’t get why you see that as lazy… Honestly I don’t care, But this is the problem with “programming” “communities”, They’re hardly a community, It’s mostly people stealing from each other, And if they can’t find something to steal they hate… In the end it was wrong of me to ask on such a forum, The result was pretty obvious, People are gonna try to sound like smart asses… geez…
And @everyoneelse Making a demo would kill the purpose of a demo, I don’t have good enough assets to put in the engine and show a good demo… But here’s a preview…
Geez people in here are so dumb…
Maybe your OP should have said somewhere, “Message me if you are interested and want details,” or similar. Instead it gives no indication of what to expect other than whatever the project is, it’s ambitious enough to require it’s own 3D artist(s) and composer(s). Hard to get interested in a lack of detail.
Now you’re getting overly defensive and are straight up insulting us. But don’t listen to me, I’m just a smartass.
Says the guy demanding free labor…
I’ve honestly been trying to help you. I don’t think anything I’ve said was unreasonable. Your reaction has shown more than any demo possibly could.
[quote=“ABOODYFJ,post:36,topic:53780”]
Flip the roles: Say I’m an artist, and I tell you that “all I need is a programmer to make a game, I can make the art. I expect you to work 6 hours a day.”
Wouldn’t you want to see some of the other art I’ve done? Wouldn’t you want to see some proof that working for me, for free, would be beneficial to you? If I reacted to that by calling you stupid, would you want to work for me? That’s all we’re asking. If you can’t do that, then you aren’t ready to lead a team. There’s nothing wrong with that.
Ah, there it is. Good luck. I’m sure you’ll go far with your attitude.
Your first comment was far from constructive, So you come of as a non constructive hater, So therefore I tell you to go read something else.
Some things are better discussed privately, For example, Why would I want to show work to people that are not interested in the project ? If someone is interested in such a thing they could contact me and talk to me and see where I’m coming from, They can then see my “framework” and my “portfolio and previous projects”…
But you become offensive and you don’t want me to be defensive, Doesn’t make sense really.
And if you keep thinking that your perspective is the only “right” one, Then you’re in for a harsh awakening.
You’re missing the entire point of what everyone is saying because you didn’t get what you wanted. If you would listen instead of trying desperately to not change anything about your initial request, then you would see that most of us are trying to help you out and tell you that the way you are doing things right now is not going to get you anywhere. NO ONE wants to work for free. NO ONE will come work for you without a portfolio of their potential employer to be present, NO ONE wants to work on a project which has no design documents, or plan. What you gave us is this, basically:
I have an engine, I want to make a game. I need free labor, you have to be this old, and you must do this.
Now, if you would step back a minute and calm down you would understand that your “plan” is exactly the opposite of that; you don’t have a plan. Or, you have no presented us with a plan.
Come back with a solid goal, a portfolio, a demo, and compensation, and then you might have a chance for a team to work out. Currently, as it stands, you will not be getting anywhere. Especially not calling everyone in this forum a smartass because you didn’t get what you wanted.