Finishing is hard.

General Discussions
#1

Hello everyone. I’ve never posted before, so I apologize if I sound awkward. I’m probably like a lot of you, I’m hardcore into the idea of making a video game just to make a childhood dream come true. I’m not in it for money, and I’m not in it for fame. I just want to reawaken that dead 12 year old corpse inside and make him happy.

I don’t know how to introduce myself, since I haven’t really posted in forums since back in the Amiga days, but here goes. I’m working on a game with my friend, and it’s almost 2 years in. We hit a slump about 3 months ago, and decided to take a look at our favorite C64 games, write all of the objects/enemies into objects and just try to finish it. The new plan of giving up has ironically paid off in that we will finish our basic build by the end of the year. The games we based our objects on were Pitfall 2, Montezuma’s Revenge, and Bruce Lee. My friend knows nothing about programming, so I wrote him an editor that allows him to place 2 background layers, a walk layer, and 2 foreground layers. It’s a 2D tile thing. Originally, like all of us dumbasses, I wanted to recreated something like Super Metroid. We realized our limitations and that we aren’t going to make money, and that this is stupid; it inspired us.

I apologize if this post is just a faux pas, cause I’m an idiot. The thing is, this shit is my dream, and I don’t give a fuck if it’s irrational, and am not doing it for anything other than satisfying myself. I’m sure a lot of you are in the same boat, and it’s a cool ride. I’ve read some other posts about the hell of moving platforms and collision detection. I’ve been there and done that, and by far the hardest thing was fake NES platform movement. I spent forever on the rotating platforms, but it was fun as hell.

The amazing thing for me, is that it is all done in Java. We have fake scanlines, real-time C64 soft-synth, and everything is smooth as fuck fullscreen 60 FPS. Yeah, back in the old days we did the same with C and Allegro, but it’s really encouraging that Java has grown up so much, especially stuff like Minecraft.

We’re in the last stretch of this project. It’s a lot of fucking work. Sorry for swearing. The fact is, some of us are sad people, and we really want to realize our dreams, even if they’re stupid. I’m 34 years old, and almost at the career death knell of 35. Do I care? No. If I can finish this project, I’ll die a happy man.

Anyway, I’ll shut up, and I’m just a drunk idiot, posting my thoughts to a forum to which I probably shouldn’t be a member of, but yeah, I just thought I’d introduce myself.

Thanks,

Rich

#2

Wow…I have nothing much to say other than welcome to JGO and thank you a lot for posting your thoughts!

#3

Welcome and good luck! I’ve been making games since I was 10 years old with Click-n-create-programs and I still haven’t finished a single game. I’m 19 now. xD

#4

Interesteting. Can you share screenshot. Anything really.

#5

Hi

I’m younger, I work mostly alone (but some people here gave me some tricks), I’m almost in the same boat. Don’t give up. Keep the the good work. I don’t really like my job, it is mainly a pay-the-bills job like Renanse (Joshua Slack, the main developper of Ardor3D) says. I didn’t know that “faux pas” has become a typical English expression, it comes from my mother tongue :smiley: Best regards.

#6

In case it helps, there is a really nice article here with tips on how to finish games.

#7

Games are never really finished are they?

Well I have make 15 games and 12 of them have been published. I plan I releasing a game today and 4 more before the new year.

So, don’t say finished just get it out there and say your published instead.

#8

[quote]Interesteting. Can you share screenshot. Anything really.
[/quote]
Tile Style

Skull Hill

Spider

Splash

Fly Path

Map Editor

Map Stitcher (drag&drop maps to form world)

Instrument Editor - For SID like synth sounds.

I apologize for my stupid previous post, and promise not to post again until the project is done. Thanks!

#9

Looks good! Is it inspired by Cave Story? If it isn’t, be sure to check it out. It’s basically the god of all 2D platformers if you ask me! =D

Don’t worry, we’ve had a few weird posts recently, so it’s just funny. xD Ahahaha…

#10

I Really like the look of those trees. So cool. Can’t wait to test that game.

#11

Welcome, Rich! Your story is my story. You can do it.

Cas :slight_smile:

#12

Hey kappa, the link to the article you posted is the article that got us out of our slump.

Before we were just doing graphics and sound, and everything else was just hypothetical dreaming. After reading that article I realized what I needed to do, inventoried everything in my favorite games of my youth, and then I set out to create them. In typical lazy American fashion, I decided I’d give myself 1 week per object. I went out drinking and told a German ex-pat of my ideas and schedule, he told me I was lazy. He was right. I spend a month and wrote the following objects:

Balloon (Pitfall 2)
Blocker (invisible object that only some objects obey, used to limit ranges, etc.)
Bomb (like bombs in Montezuma’s Revenge, spawns influencer particles)
Bullet (just a dumb bullet, pure Atari)
Climbable Wall (like the stuff you climbed in Bruce Lee)
Collectible (keys and stuff to influence logic later)
Collectible Switch (like the lanterns in Bruce Lee. Has time based on and off status if desired)
Conveyor (dumb object to provide X influence, jump through)
Electical Field (like in Bruce Lee, the zappers that killed you)
Flier (flying objects with dumb sine pattern, like in Pitfall 2… bats, buzzards)
Gate (Objects to block passage, can be set to be bombable, or require collectibles)
Hopper (frogs in Pitfall 2)
InvisibleInfluencer (used for bomb influence, Wind, water flow)
Laser (like lasers in Monzezuma’s Revenge)
Liquid (Water or lava… dumb sine bobbing for objects, simply buoyancy, triggerable height level)
Movable Box (dumb box pushing)
OnOffSwitch (switch for triggerables, can be set to be a one-time deal, and to focus camera temporarily on events triggered by switch actions, e.g. offscreen, or even off-scene shit)
Pixel Particle (non collision detected particle object from a particle pool to be fast)
Player Object (you)
Pole (Montzeuma’s Revenge fire poles)
Roller (Montezuma’s Revenge skulls)
Rotating Platform (moving platform that uses sin/cos a bit)
Shooter (objects that fire bullets in desired direction)
SpringBoard (Mappy Land trampolines)
SwitchableTileBridge (exploding bridge in Contra)
TileObject (wrapper for tiles, since everything collision detected is part of same interface)
TimedPlatform (Time disappearing and reappearing platforms form Megaman)
Walker (contains multiple variations, used for dumb enemies)

It was insane, but we have gotten more done in the last 3 months than the previous year. It just takes somebody telling you that you are lazy.

The weakness with our game is enemies. With the aforementioned objects we have lots of puzzle elements and potential, and have completed 3 out of our 5 planned levels, each containing 10-20 screens. I would like to do better, but don’t want to blow a wad. We need to finish this stupid thing, only so I can go get drunk and not think about such nonsense. Nah, I’m cursed, and this is what we do. Our player object can’t kill. The enemies are obstacles. I want to do more, but at some point you have to get it out there. That’s why I’m saying finishing is hard. I’ll never be finished though, but with this project, I plan on it as soon as possible.

Again, I apologize for blogging on a forum, but I love the shit out of Java and game programming, and maybe some of you won’t call me a poofter for posting such nonsense.

Richesian

#13

Sorry guys. I didn’t mean to come off as arrogant or anything like that. I won’t post here again.

#14

Not at all, man. Hang around. Keep everyone updated with how it goes. Every mighty oak grows from an acorn etc etc.

Cas :slight_smile:

#15

Not genetically enhanced oaks that grow from potatoes, but I get your point and I agree. =)

#16

Thanks. I’m sorta socially retarded, and felt like a bragging idiot, so sabotaged my old account. It didn’t help that I had a few beers, read some other discussions and saw the variable username insertions. In my megalomaniac stupor I didn’t realize that, no, those weren’t mocking jabs at me. Yes, I feel like an idiot, but that’s good. Humility keeps my head on straight.

I shared a couple of years worth of work and felt like I was showing my cards when I don’t know if I have a good hand. I’ll continue to post updates as I hit milestones. I’d really like to be able to share levels as they are completed to get any feedback, especially negative/constructive feedback. Thanks for being understanding. For a while I’m going to catch up and read as much as I can here to digest the proper etiquette and learn a thing or two about what all of you are doing and/or have done.

Formerly Richesian,

Rich

#17

[quote]The thing is, this shit is my dream, and I don’t give a f**k if it’s irrational, and am not doing it for anything other than satisfying myself
[/quote]
This is all that matters. Why are you so apologetic? Being bull-headed and driven is the only way to success in this adventure. You’re enjoying what you do, but too concerned with the results. You said it yourself–you enjoy working on this stuff. Always design with the goal in mind, but don’t get fixated on how much/how well it’s done at any given time. Why? It will always get better. You will make it better–that’s what you do! The only failure is giving up.

Who’s telling this to you? Another early 30’s guy who has ideas for a game he wants to make, doesn’t give a shit if it’s popular or commercially viable and has gone through lots of re-writes, re-designs, etc. and will go through more, without a doubt.

I write software for casino machines in the day, mostly using C++, and, in my free time work on a game in Java. The same game I have been working on as a free time project for the last 6 years. I’ve been affected by changing jobs, being in jail (smuggled out algorithms on paper, heh), design flaws that became apparent after months of development and temporary burnout, but I’m still doing this damned thing, even if it kills me.

We are so lucky to have such powerful machines, free development languages/tools, and the internet. The top tier game developers are so mired in marketing, recycling the same damn games year after year, paranoid about recouping their costs. Hollywood syndrome. It’s up to us independents to make new, interesting and unique game experiences!

#18

This is all that matters. Why are you so apologetic? Being bull-headed and driven is the only way to success in this adventure. You’re enjoying what you do, but too concerned with the results. You said it yourself–you enjoy working on this stuff. Always design with the goal in mind, but don’t get fixated on how much/how well it’s done at any given time. Why? It will always get better. You will make it better–that’s what you do! The only failure is giving up.

Who’s telling this to you? Another early 30’s guy who has ideas for a game he wants to make, doesn’t give a shit if it’s popular or commercially viable and has gone through lots of re-writes, re-designs, etc. and will go through more, without a doubt.

I write software for casino machines in the day, mostly using C++, and, in my free time work on a game in Java. The same game I have been working on as a free time project for the last 6 years. I’ve been affected by changing jobs, being in jail (smuggled out algorithms on paper, heh), design flaws that became apparent after months of development and temporary burnout, but I’m still doing this damned thing, even if it kills me.

We are so lucky to have such powerful machines, free development languages/tools, and the internet. The top tier game developers are so mired in marketing, recycling the same damn games year after year, paranoid about recouping their costs. Hollywood syndrome. It’s up to us independents to make new, interesting and unique game experiences!
[/quote]
+1. And you smuggled out algorithms? Sorry, but that made me lol. xD Now THAT is determination, even going to jail because of computer related stuff and then keep going. Read and learn, guys. Read and learn.

#19

That’s the difference between design and development. For some one is easy for other the other is easy. Usually having the ability to do both is the magic ability.

It happens a lot in web programming. Developers make the data accessible and organized then the designer makes it look good.

#20

theagentd,

I don’t mean to hijack this thread, but, to elaborate, when you’re in jail, your mind is your only playground.

I wasn’t in jail for computer-related crime, just possession of a laughably small amount of a derivative of a certain popular plant.

We were not allowed to keep anything written while incarcerated after release because the authorities believed we would create and maintain criminal contacts with former cellmates. I had no access to a computer, but used paper and pen to map out rendering algorithms and geometry processing procedures. I had so much time, I even debugged them in my head.

Seriously, look at all of us. Jail, parenthood, employment, poverty, social pressure to be mere consumers, math ineptitude… we persevere!

It’s what we do! 8)