The main problem with this community

General Discussions
#81

I almost never look in Showcase because usually it’s just full of crap half-finished rubbish and I’ve gotten numb to the disappointment so I don’t bother any more. Sorry, just got my honest blunt hat on again today. But if anything’s going to move forward then someone’s got to start telling it like it is. We’ve been at this for years now and nothing seems to have changed much.

Talked to Kev earlier on, he had a couple more observations:

  1. Showcase should really be for finished, properly finished stuff.
  2. There might otherwise more usefully be a “Feedback” topic for those that want to give feedback on works in progress.
  3. It’s worth noting that the people that have succeeded with Java in games, Oddlabs, Three Rings, Chrome, Agency9, don’t get involved on JGO at all.

Cas :slight_smile:

#82

What do you mean exactly? Agency9 made the FPS called Megacorps Online and they stopped it because this:

[quote]The project was canceled due to a shift in our business focus. The source code was never released. The game is based on our 3D-engine, AgentFX, and the idea was to have a game demo to serve as a proof-of-concept for AgentFX.

We shifted our business from 3D-engine licensing to developing and licesning ready-to-go applications. Currently we offer two products: 3DMaps EX, an on-line 3D map visualization product and Madlix 3DGreetings, a 3D application for mobile phones to send personalized and animated 3D messages. Consequently we no loger offer AgentFX for licensing but it is the foundation of our products and projects.

I think we as with many others who had game projects in Java discovered that the drive from the console companies (Sony, Microsoft, Nintendo, etc) are so strong that it is difficult to see a great market success for “on-line gaming”, that is on-line as played from the web browser.
[/quote]

#83

Let’s make another full circle by mentioning blizzard and WoW.

Anyway,

I’ve seen people from the Agency9 post here occasionally. Perhaps the very luke warm response they got didn’t help in them becoming very active.

#84

[quote]I think we as with many others who had game projects in Java discovered that the drive from the console companies (Sony, Microsoft, Nintendo, etc) are so strong that it is difficult to see a great market success for “on-line gaming”, that is on-line as played from the web browser.
[/quote]
I cant stay saying nothing when I read such…, so I want to disagree with that point, inded if you have to install anything there is no more interrest than a .exe, but the good thing is that Java is on most plateforms, IMHO online game is a very good target for Java game as for flash. but I think there is two points that should not be missed :
1 - dont try to make the lastest AAA game, cause there are no interrest to run such game “online” in a browser,
2 - dont use all lastest JVM fancy features because the game will run about nowhere except on your own and friends computers.

web game must be the most compatible as possible, cause that the main interrest of a web game is to be played from different location easily and in opposition of others games is not to be installed everywhere.

NB: I really like the work of Ben Librojo who match exacly how a Java web game should be made, you just know that you can play those games from everywhere you are : at home/at work/at family/at friends etc… lot of demo/game dont run anymore when I start them from another computer than mine… as the previews I mentionned above (towerdefence) and wich I just tried from one of my family computer which is not java developpers computer.

#85

princec. I have to disagree.

I have seen some really fun games here on jgo. I have seen some crappy ones as well. but the good ones out weigh the bad ones by far. There are a few java games that I play in my free time. You are targeting the minority. when the majority of games are fun.

Don’t expect polished games from programmers. That is why there are arists. Most games you will see here, are not artisticaly pleasing. Most get their merit for A, Not needing to much graphics, or B, Having amazing features.

#86

I think JGO should have this, may weed out the two and then the visitor wanted to see the showcase he can and not get incomplete games.

#87

when is a game really “complete”. some games are playable right now. But the person is still working on it.

#88

What is a game!? A miserable little pile of bugs! But enough talk, HAVE AT YOU!
context: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMTizJemHO8

#89

I agree - let the Showcase be complete games, and possibly add a couple other forums:

  1. Gameplay experiments
  2. Works-in-progress

A wiki would be great, since over time a lot of the same questions get asked again and again.

As for attracting artists here - well, I really don’t see how that’s going to happen. Processing attract artists; maybe JavaFX eventually will.

#90

I disagree with you. I met this problem when I wanted to create an incubator in the previous JGT. Which precise and objective criteria can be used to determine whether a game is incomplete or complete?

#91

That’s the problem… if one doesn’t know what the criteria are to go showing people stuff, one should probably go back to doing research on the matter first.

Cas :slight_smile:

#92

Coming back to this comment, it did occur to me today that the same is true of Kongregate. Check out the “New games” section and it’s full of “My first maze game” and “HOWTO on custom cursors”. The difference is that it’s not a forum, so it organises by things other than date, and the rating system and number of visitors allow it to bury the crap and, dare I say it, showcase the good stuff.

#93

I’m dismayed that Kev has decided to quit the forum - I always felt that he added a lot. I really hope that he reconsiders.

Personally, I love this community. Yes, there is a lot of dross out there - I don’t see that as a problem, I just don’t play it all. There are a few people who usually have something worthwhile to say, and I tend to watch what they have to say.

#94

+1 a WIP section would be good and exist in most forum

#95

If we did do a showcase and a wip section, we would have to form a rule or two, or a guidelines post on what determines an completed game, and maybe require a simple template posting guideline, to help present games.

#96

The system to differentiate the complete game of the uncomplete game doesn’t have to be perfect. You will always have people posting in the wrong section but having a wip section and a showcase section would still greatly help.

#97

I don’t want any litigious situation. What would happen if an author puts his game in the section containing complete games and the moderator moves it into the section of incomplete games whereas the author considers his game to be complete?

#98

Is it that much of a problem? People will still be able to see your game and some work in progress (WIP) might still be great game too. You can’t say that in general it wouldn’t help, can you?

It’s sure that sometimes great ‘complete’ game will be put in WIP and horrible game will be in showcase. You can’t get around that. Even the best definition of a complete game won’t solve that, but I still think a WIP section would be great.

N.B. A failed game section might be the solution to horrible complete game but I don’t think it’s correct to put a section like that…

#99

I can say much the same. Javagaming.org and the 4k competitions in particular is what kept my interest in games development up, which ultimately is one of the main reasons I chose to study computer science (which I’ve now been doing for almost four years).

I think it’s been and still is a great community, and it is by far the forum I’ve been the most active in. Which implies it’s an interesting and entertaining community!

With that said, I’m sure one could make improvements in some areas. You always can. However, I’d like to extend my sincere thanks to everybody who’s been shaping and participating in this community. You’re great! :slight_smile:

#100

maybe only moderator should be able to put game in the showcase (getting them from the WIP), so it will make a clean Showcase, when the WIP will become the actual Showcase