And I thought I was the only one who hijacked threads to go off on my own tangential rants… 
[quote=“nsigma,post:37,topic:55681”]
Bwah? Have you ever seen a big development office? I don’t know a single corporate help desk that would choose linux over Windows…
When I begin to regret something I have done or some path I’ve chosen, I always tell myself this, which kinda cheers me up:
The moment counts! Whenever you enjoy doing something for the moment when you are doing it, everything is fine. Nothing else counts.
There is no point in later ‘regretting’ what you’ve done, because your point of view changes constantly of what you think would be worthwhile doing, and what not.
It’s also when people look at software, they themselves or someone else wrote in the past.
I NEVER EVER heard one developer say: “Oh, that is good code. I can understand and use it right away.”
I think we all know this. People tend to criticise everything. Even their own code.
But that is of course fine, because things constantly change, and ones attitude and opinions and knowledge about something changes.
But that does not mean that it wasn’t good back then, because there was no other way to do it.
So, what people always seem to ignore/forget about, is the state of mind and the knowledge of the person who wrote that code in the past at that time.
Now how does this relate to the existential crisis topic?
Questioning yourself whether you should/should not have done something in the past is irrelevant. Because such questioning disregards the state of mind/knowledge/beliefs of the past and instead uses the “current” situation to evaluate the past.
So, always be happy with what you do. You wouldn’t have decided otherwise and regretting it later leads nowhere. 
Oh and also sorry for off-topic!
More Buddhism “Wash the dishes to wash the dishes.”
Cas
[quote=“KevinWorkman,post:41,topic:55681”]
And I thought I was the only one who hijacked threads to go off on my own tangential rants…
I ain’t hijacking - I was correcting the stupid “few thousand” users comment above. The vaguely correlating stats would suggest maybe OSX is 80 million+, Linux is 20-30 million+.
And who said anything about Linux over Windows - a lot of the developers I know, for some unknown reason, use OSX. Though more use Linux than Windows. Some are in large corporate environments. The point was it’s about knowing your own relevant market share, not blindly following estimates.
I wasn’t talking about you.
[quote=“nsigma,post:45,topic:55681”]
I don’t disagree with that. But I think Windows has a much larger market share than anecdotal “every developer I know uses linux” claims.
Fair enough! It was above a quote from me. I’ll cop to now assisting in the hijack though. ;D
Absolutely! My point was mainly that if you use the overall market share to claim providing developer tools for Linux doesn’t make sense, you can also apply the same argument to OSX. Developer usage of both is going to be at a far higher percentage than the overall figures. Windows almost certainly still has the majority amongst developers - it’s just going to be a lower majority. I’m definitely not using the “every developer I know uses Linux” argument - in fact, if I was basing this only on people I know it would be OSX in the lead.
Well, the hard facts from my perspective are that Linux users are worth about 3% of revenue and Mac users are another 7% or so. These statistics are based on some rather large datasets, and a reasonable conclusion I draw from them is that Windows brings in 90% of the money. Anyone sane in business would allocate development resources accordingly… and that’s why Unity’s tools target Windows primarily, and luckily for Mac users, they get to use Unity too. There’s about 97% of the potential userbase right there.
Just use the right tools for the job, m’kay? Linux is great on the serverside. It’s utter shit as a client, and likely always will be, and even if it ain’t, there are two other mainstream OSes that solve everyone’s problems already, better.
Cas
Oh and just one more thing… you wouldn’t seriously develop and test a product on a day-to-day basis on Linux knowing full well that 90% of its target deployments are Windows, now, would you? Would you?
Cas
I personally don’t make games to please other people, i do it to try and improve my coding practices, help develop my own tool lib and to have fun. In the past i got bored making games so i started working on my own lib to help me create windows based components in LWJGL like; buttons, text boxes, etc and then to wright a jQuery based event system like in js to handle all events…and it turned out to be more fun then making games… BUT since i have done all this work i have been able to think of new games and now i have a HUGE screen manager lib to handle GUI for me 
…its a win win.
In the end, do what makes you happy, that’s all that matters.
Actually it’s always the opposite. I always think Linux usage is much much larger than it actually is…like say 2%, but it’s not that big (too lazy to go look) .
So I should put boats and dinosaurs in my car game. And as fast as possible, ignoring any other more immediate car-game concerns, time-schedules, etc. etc., because some magic number of people are asking for them? Caring for someone’s opinion != doing what they ask. And even if you do, you do it a the right time.
Gosh, who’d have thought it takes time to make software.
Only a hobbyist would be tripped up by this issue.
Linux in only free to hobbyists. Everyone else puts some value on their time.
Those that drown in the teacup? Nothing worth mentioning unless they’ve grown up since.
NOTE: There’s value to having a linux port beyond having a linux port. Supporting multiple compilers/OSes helps you keep your code future-proof. It’s designed becomes more portable.
You’ve missed my point by a long shot. I’ve been using Linux continuously since the only “distribution” was: download the source, compile and bootstrap it yourself. It has nothing to do with a Linux editor. Swap the situation where there was only a linux editor and no windows. Same thing holds. If some minor detail like this stops you in your tracks…you’re drowning in a teacup. And people who drown in teacups don’t (at least yet) have what it takes to stick their nose to the grindstone for years to complete 1 project.
Go to say twitter and ask pro game devs. They’ll have about 3-5 machines and will be running both.
To be fair, Linux has a massive advantage over Windows as a development platform…
Since running windows games on it is such a pain in the ass, it’s easier to avoid procrastination! ;D ;D ;D
More seriously, my main reason to use Linux as a dev environment is because of a personal interest in using freely available tools (including the OS), as well as on multi-platform development, but it’s just me (And I do test on Windows, although I guess my licensed windows version will sooner than later become outdated).
BUT, I don’t live off of my game development projects, I’m just a hobbyist, so I could afford to develop on an old graphing calculator if I wanted to.
Your statistics there are not really relevant! They’re about end user base not development user base. To counter with some other stats that are almost as irrelevant - Eclipse user stats per primary OS - Windows 55%, Linux 35%, OSX 9% (from 2013 because that’s latest I found quickly). It proves that overall desktop usage stats do not necessarily correlate with developer usage stats. And neither of those will be any use in calculating Unity3D developer usage per OS.
Yep! A huge chunk of software development happens on OS and hardware different from the end use system. That’s what testing is for. 
Reminds me of web front end development, where you’d make it work correctly on a standard browser and then “fix” it for IE. Anyway, just because it works fine on one Windows install hardly means it works everywhere.
Well, yes, me too pretty much, not that I’m a pro game dev. I’m talking about primary development OS of choice. I consider my forays into the Windows world a penance for past sins. ;D
Saying truly it’s not about popularity or money –
It’s about find some friends that have time to play with you and
who are interested in things that you do)
Yes we all lonely – and don’t have (even) 9 friends always online to play dota ^^
(or other games)
-So making games in this cases (like hobbyst) – about making friends,
not popularity or millions of money )
I have same feeling and story bro(
-And i find solution (for my self)
You don’t need to be on first place - bests game of century or make billions from one game.
You be happy having free time for game development, and maybe even making money from it for living
-so don’t make this idea harder(more complicated) then it is =)
Its isn’t ^^
You same can go buy lottery ticket and win big pile of money.
But its not about game development
game development in 99% – is hard work
and only in 1% left - its luck
if you’re game sells low count– don’t wait miracle
do something with that – add new features, maybe listen stupid backers.
offtop about lottery
(and even don’t think about ppl that wait miracle and suddenly win lottery – they have own lives
When one man win lottery – from other side million lose it
what connects them? they all waits mirracle and its good that even one man win,
because they all can easely lose)
XD
Also – understand
Its not about making what other ppl said
Its about listen some other ppl that you don’t want to listen and even answer them.
And shame – don’t have solution for it (((
(ignore them or agro on stupid ideas – wrong solution,
And answer all – is hard but what else you can do)
maybe I find some solutions when have such big real situation ^^
p.s and plz stop offtop about linux – windows ((
there is no solution for this dispute
If I had a choice…I’d choose neither. UNIX and VMS based systems are rooted in 60s/70s tech with some duct-table and super-glued extras stuck on. I remember in high school (late 80s) reading a research paper that outlined how user/group and permission bits was broken beyond repair. This was well before virus and malware were things. Sadly nobody seems to actually read OS related research. Hell, I stopped because what’s the point…nobody is doing anything with it anyway. The whole Linux vs. windows vs. mac thing to me reads: My rube-goldberg toaster and dog-poop scooper is better than your rube-goldberg toaster and dog-poop scooper. Personally I just want a toaster that can ignore because it “just works”.
More of a Heath Robinson man meself Typical Brit - got there first but generally forgotten by everyone else. He may also be more apt if you know your computing history.
Generally agree with you. My personal beef with Windows is more to do with feeling unfamiliar these days, and with being fed up of fixing family IT problems - Chrome OS ftw there! 8)
@Icecore - this OT was nothing to do with Linux vs Windows vs toasters. It was to do with misrepresentation of the stats around developer OS usage for both Linux and OSX, which between them probably have ~40% market share (another more recent survey from Stack Overflow - OSX 20%, Linux 20%)
I think there are far more Linux users then the numbers on those diagrams represent. Obvious though because I have never participated in any kind of survey as far as I know and I’m sure more did. Or Ubuntu must have been sneaking some data when I didn’t look.
Ignoring them isn’t a right thing either. Companies who do not listen to their customers will eventually lose them. That happened to many companies, it has been the start of many faillisements. Not that Unity Technologies would go down because of this, but it never leaves you with a good image anyway. Hobbyists turn eventually into professionals. Those will be UT’s customers in the future.
I’m very damn well aware of that. But really? 5 years for a port? You surely don’t mean that. It has by far anything to do with developing that port only. The entire discussion about whether it was a good idea or not had to do with it as well. There was far more stuff involved then just the development only. I wont list every part of that discussion because Graham wrote an entire blogpost about it which I’m too lazy to search for right now. But the point is UT had far more things to concider.
No they wont. If you’d browse through their comments you’d see responses from actual companies.
It is time you grow up. There are voters who actually are working for a company. Voters who sell games. Voters who develop more than just games. Really, you put them all at one line, saying they are amateurs who are unable to archieve anything yet your profile shows 0 projects? Really? If I didn’t know better you are the one drowing in a teacup, not me, nor them. Okay, I admit. My profile shows 0 projects as well. But I do develop more than just games, because I have been in the commercial software development business for a while now. I develop software and apps for companies. Games is something I do in my spare time.
I am using Windows and Linux. I have been in that “teacup” of yours and I did complete projects. There goes your theory.
Heath Robinson? Fair enough. I had to look-up the computing history bit.
TheBoneJarmer: A suggestion. You should work on your reading comprehension.
The number of desktop end-users that only have a linux (or mac) machine only matters for their runtime. The number of developers that only have linux (or mac) machines doesn’t matter at all. Any developer worth worrying about could have run the editor on a windows box. Or they could go to some other engine that had a linux editor. Or they could have starting writing their own engine. Or they could have become a waiter.
That whole “reading comprehension” thing above.
If a company gets knocked over my a mouse fart of this size they don’t stay in business very long.
Requesting something one considers desirable != “OMG!! I’m TOTALLY not going to use your PRODUCT until I get what “I” want”.
“reading comprehension” again. If any minor details “stops” someone in their tracks, then yeah…they aren’t going to be able to complete a serious project. Pretty much the definition of amateurish.
It’s good to see you know better.
I stated no theory. I made axiomatic statements. Here’s some more:
Postulate 1: If an entity refused to run the Unity editor in windows when it was the only available editor, then probability of that entity having completed a Unity project is approaching zero.
Postulate 2: Given an entity from Postulate 1 that didn’t seek out an alternate solution to using Unity to complete their project, then the probability that the project is now completed is approaching zero.
For completeness sake I’m mention an obvious solution I skipped. Someone could have done the port and made a pull request.